exploding nodes

[ilsefa]

I've read the great harvest guide Doubletap put up (Thank you!) but seem to be missing something there.

From the guide it seems the only way to keep a node from exploding, or worse depleting, is to have another harvester to work with. If not the case, what am I missing?

I have a care plan but can't figure out how to make it go into the extraction plan or the prospecting plan. I hate prematurely depleting a resource but really am at a loss what else to try. I don't have a harvest buddy. Help? Please?

[evalisa]

dont put it into the extraction plan

if you noice the heart is about to hit 0 hit the care plan and it wil lgo into yournext action, keep caring untill the heart is back up enouth for you to extract a bit more, or untill the timer is up

[bgrifter]

Or simply do the classic Harvester Butt Plant (tm) when the node gets close to an explosion, let the node expire. He who digs and runs away lives to dig another day. :D

That said, you should definitely try to keep your hitpoints up to a level where you can take at least one explosion on the chin. Worst case you're using HP Heal instead of Focus Heal for a round...

[fratt37]

I finally got a system going now with my Care actions
Beware of preserve2, very effective but VERY expensive in the focus department
Like in the above posts, while extracting if you see things going badly: Heart going down fast, and you want to be able to continue prospecting there, activate preserve. It takes a turn to begin so don't do it at the last second, it takes a bit of timing.
[edit oh yes, try to wait until you get at least 1 of Q(whatever) message, then if things are going bad hit preserve. Then you know you are getting at least 1 peice and of what quality. This is where it gets time consuming, because you only get one, and you will have to prospect the site again]

I guess the goal is to finish the extraction, and still have some life left in the Heart Bar, then you know you can continue prospecting there.

NOTE:explosions or gas clouds don't destroy the resource. I noticed that they don't affect the health bar, it goes down or stays constant regardless of what the risk bar is doing. I have had many explosions from the same site, and as long as I keep some health next to the heart when the Timer runs out I can continue prospecting. If you can withstand the explosion, and/or are out of the range of the cloud, don't sweat those. I am not sure of all the stats yet, and I still need to read DT's guide so I am still learning:)

If you are on your favorite CHOICE or higher resource spot, using preserve correctly, while VERY time/focus consuming, will allow you to extract for a much higher quantity. When I wasn't sure how to use preserve I was getting 1 or 2 pieces of varying quality. Sometimes if the site was somewhat more stable I could prospect it a couple times. Using preserve, I get as many as 15 (more if not distracted by predators!!) pieces of Q20 choice stuff.

If I start an extraction and i see Basic, or a mat I am not interested in I just hit Ctrl-S(cancel current action) I mapped it to the Page Down key.

I could see needing another player to run preserve to get higher quantities from each extraction, but I think there would have to be a duel for dibs;)

[ayne31]

My problem is that even with extraction time 35 time was running out faster than I could execute the care plan long enough. maybe I did something wrong though.

[fratt37]

My problem is that even with extraction time 35 time was running out faster than I could execute the care plan long enough. maybe I did something wrong though.

I am using extract 30s, preserve1, prospect for excellent, agressive extract 50, accelerated prospect, agressive time2, extraction rate 1.0, i might be missing some.

When the extraction starts i watch the quality, when it hits 20(highest you can get in newbland), i look at the life of the site, if it's dropping, I get ready with preserve, if I get the 1 of q20 message and the life is still going down i hit preserve. If at any point the life bar drops below half and is still dropping i hit preserve. If for some reason the site is more stable, or the bar stops dropping i wait, and if the extractin goes smoothly, as in the quality stays high, i will get 2 peices from the extraction.

I hope this helps:)
I am in Matis btw, I don't know if that also makes a difference.

EDIT
OK, I have read DT's guide, and I see all the very wasteful things i have been doing and buying. Prospect Excellent, and Extract Q50 are way higher than what I need on newbland. And I completely forgot about ground stability. I don't think Focus will be such a problem for me anymore, and I expect to have even more fun now. Time to get my butt to the mainland

[larsa]

Also look at the source mode number when you start extraction. The mode gives you a general idea about how the source will behave during the extraction.

Helps you to determine whether a care plan will be useful or whether you should just cancel the extraction. Note that you can cancel an extraction and immediately start another extraction on the same resource spot - you might get another source mode then.

[vguerin]

The higher your level the more ways you have to prevent "exploding nodes"... I avoid it entirely by using "gentle" extraction and paying attention. All the "harmful" level bonuses occur long before the gentle ones, so I do use them at times. When this occurs I have a care plan at my disposal to change the properties of the source as well as the ability to change the source mode.

You can hit a source with your own care plan and go back to harvesting it if you have the "source time" and focus remaining. Typically two actions with a care plan restore the source enough to allow you to get the next material.

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[michie7b]

The 'Extraction Plan' consists of three bricks you have to use:

- quality
- speed
- rate


Each of these three bricks has an 'aggressiveness'. The higher the aggressiveness, the faster the 'life' and 'risk' bars of a ressource node runs out. If the life bar runs out, the node will be destroyed or depleted. If the risk bar runs out, it makes boom.

Each of these three bricks has 'gentle' and 'harmful' variants. The gentle bricks cause less 'aggressiveness' than the harmful ones.

Once you get higher in skill, and aquire a bigger focus pool (dexterity)and a faster focus regeneration (will), you can learn additional (optional) stanzas for your extraction plans.


Lake Extraction Specialisation *1): this stanza reduces the 'aggressiveness' of two of the bricks.

Fiber Extraction Specialisation *2): this stanza reduces the 'aggressiveness' of the third brick. It also adds +50 to the quality you would normally be able to extract with an extraction brick.


Of course there is a backdraw...
Each of these two bricks adds another 10 action cost.

And another advantage...
The more gentle you work, the smaller the damage of the explosion and acid cloud will be.



How to not kill Ressource-Nodes:

Once you do have ~60 dex/will, and a 250+ Focus self heal, you can use a 32 action cost (uses 20 Focus per cycle) extraction plan: gentle speed 1, gentle rate 1, gentle quality 1, lake specialisation. With that you can reliably extract 2 ressources within 45 seconds, without blowing up the ressource node 90% of the time, or only take 70 damage.

Of course you will always spot people next to you who will pull out 3-4 ressources, and blow up stuff all about you, and when you are near them, they'll hit you for 300+, and leave you dead. o_O !!

I tried to put both the area and the material extraction specialisations into an extraction plan, but I do not yet have the better gentle bricks (besides quality), and when I use the harmful bricks for rate and speed, it still blows up fairly often. Though I do get 4 ressources reliably.

Also: the 32 action cost plans use 20 focus per cylce, the 64 action cost plans use 50 focus per cycle. So even when I do pull out 4 instead of only 2 ressources, it uses more than double focus, and drains too fast.


Yours,
Luned. ;o)



*1)There is a variant of the 'area' specialisations for each Lake (Tryker), Desert (Fyros?), Forest (Matis), Jungle (?) areas- I did not see one for the Roots.

*2)There is a specialisation for each Material. Some materials seem to be summed up in one group (wood: bark, wood, wood node).

[ilsefa]

Thanks for all the good tips. I've learned a bit and don't die too often now and can keep from depleting an area for longer periods of time.

I do use the "harvester butt plant" a lot, sometimes to prevent a depletion or explosion, other times when I know resource number or quality will not go up and I don't want to waste the focus for the timer to run out. I can't get more than one resource and implement any care plan yet so I've been saving the focus.

Does care plan influence the next node you spawn on that spot? I haven't seen any connection but there would be a big reason to use the rest of a timer on care plans.

[selmor]

Careplans are a real goodie - if you work in teams!

But in times i go on my own, i don't use it at any time. And i get 3-4 units per source, reliable, too. But how do i do? The keyword is "source mode" ! Once you know how each mode behaves and how much units you can get off of each mode, you got it. The reliabe soucre-mode i know until yet is mode 1, thereafter mode 0. When a source starts with these modes, you get the most possible out of this source, if it starts with mode 2-5, simply change the source mode by hitting your extraction plan again. Then it will change. Thats the trick. But keep in mind, if it don't change to mode 0 or 1 within the first 3-4 cycle's, cancel the extraction and let the source expire, else you risk the source to be depleted or even worse exhausted!

Surely, mode 1 and 0 explodes at least one time within the 45s source-time, but i can withstand at least 2 explosions (and as you have to rest after each cycle, you don't have to worry about). Mode 0 is worse than 1 (on choice qu50 source it does around 250-320 explosion dam and the toxic cloud damage ticks are around 60 each time it hits you). Mode 1 does around 110-120 exp dam ant toxic-cloud hits you with 15-20 dam each tick. So, if ever possible, try to get mode 1 or if you can whitstand 2 explosions also use mode 0, but take care when you set up a toxic cloud first and keep a biiiiiiig eye on the source statistika, else you are dead meat soon.

hope it helps

regards
Selmor

[ilsefa]

I've gained a number of levels and skills in foraging since my first post here.

Agreed, the trick is watching the mode. If it comes up anything other than 1 or 0 I click again. Unfortunately, if it takes more than one click to get a more friendly mode I get less than max materials, my source time and extraction speed are so close to matched. Sometimes I can't get the mode to switch and just have to give up getting much of anything from that cycle of the node.

I still get "premature" depletion of the nodes, regardless of mode, health, explosions or anything else. I switch to gentle as soon as I get the skill and currently have gentle on 2 of my 3 options. I can almost pull indefinitely on some materials unless I get the premature depletion which seems random. Is it? Or am I missing something?

[fratt37]

Source Mode 0=Pain
It has the most lethal clouds and explosions. Guaranteed!!
SM 1 is prime, fire and forget. Weak gas, and explosions.
I don't see any advantages in the other modes. I am not done testing them.
SM 4 seems ok, but I just go with SM 1

Laharl
Harvesting Nut

[selmor]

Source Mode 0=Pain
It has the most lethal clouds and explosions. Guaranteed!!
SM 1 is prime, fire and forget. Weak gas, and explosions.
I don't see any advantages in the other modes. I am not done testing them.
SM 4 seems ok, but I just go with SM 1

Laharl
Harvesting Nut

agreed for SM 1

the damage you take from SM 0, is the same (nearly) as with SM 5. SM 4 is, compared with SM 1, the same, too. But the SL (source life) is different. SM 2 + 3 are good candidates to exhaust the area ;)

@ilsefa:

yes true. When you change the mode, you get a bit less then your maximum possible extraction. But with time you know, how many items you are able to get aproximately off one source. So, when you have to change the mode, cancel the extraction after you get your maximum extraction minus 1. (Example: you can get aprox. 4 items off a source. you have to change mode and you know, now i can get aprox. 3.9 items, so you cancel extraction after you reached 3 items and let the source expire).

regards
Selmor

[lyrah68]

Hint, DT's guide says Go ALL harmful. This MIGHT be his prefferrence, or might be due to his buying Tracking every chance he can and not having the points to go into gentle qualities.

First remap the sit key to something NOT in use, the you will remember and is comfortable to hit all the time. (yes I know about the control S thing, but TWO keys at once is hard on my left hand, so...q key works GREAT for me)

Second, get GENTLE QUALITY, aggressive speed and rate.

Third, make a MIXED extraction action with agressive speed and rate as high as your skills allow, then add the GENTLE action as high as your skill allow and "pay" for those with your credits you have. Name and learn your action.

I have been in newbie land until last night, and at 55 forager (yes I know, you should have left AGES ago, I know), I was getting ONE explosion in three hours, and a few gassings, which I easily avoided using the two step back method.

If you see the HEARTLine go dangerously low, SIT or you will have to find another node to forage. Not a problem if ALL you are doing is grinding for level, but if you have an order for a crafted item and NEED that node...a depleted node can break your heart.

Not sure if it was my LUCK or it this is just how these nodes are, but...Amber, resin and shells seem touchy, I had a mode ONE node depelete using Gentle 3 without the depletion message last night. Fibers and oils I can harvest to empty, but amber and resin seem more fragile by nature.

***Editted to add info***
Also I noted DT tends to go for two units do or die. I tend to go for ALL from one node, ONE unit at a time. Two units, just buff up the HP, you are GOING to get an explosion or gas or both(maybe more than one of each), not much you CAN do but group, to avoid this. And I plan on grouping when foraging in dangerous areas or for RARER materials, probably a fighter or two and a two foragers or more.

I just see it as the PRICE you pay for two units or more off ONE prospecting action. I saw NEGLEGIBLE difference in XP per node (and at 300 xp per extraction/prospecting, I would have noticed it.) I only got 40 more xp, but if you devide it into PER unit, two at a time is LESS xp per unit. (300 xp times two is 600, 340 for those same units is clearly LESS xp per unit, and for the same ammount of time.)

To me the one unit or two unit issue is potatoe potAtoe, in other words a serious matter of personal Prefferrence. I had a friend that was within five levels of me (to make it a more accurate test), using the SAME prospecting action and extraction action ONLY high source time for him, and with knoweldge for me. Time for prospecting was about the same.

We both got two units in the same time. TWO prospectings for me, ONE for him. He got three explosions and a gassing, if I hadn't healed him, it would have been sand nap time.

My honest advice is try his way AND my way, then do it YOUR way. There is NO right way. If you didn't destroy the node, and got the units of material...guess what...you won.

And you don't have to do it my way for me to feel better, and if you do it his way, I won't shrivel up and die.

***end added text***

This is for FYROS newbie land, your milage probably WILL vary.

[lyrah68]

And another thing that I noticed, with the friend forage test...He got LESS xp per unit than I did. SO...he was getting the same number of units, burning a BIT less focus, and getting LESS xp per unit for the same time spent.

I understand the I WANT IT ALL NOW, feeling. BUT...grabbing for two or three before the mainland is not xp friendly. So you are not getting anything faster, nor are you truly getting anything MORE than one unit at a time.

If you still chose to push for two or more units as fast as you can...so be it. Your play style I guess, but I will putter about gathering one.

I have found ONE situation where I WILL push for as many units as FAST as I can....Excellent and superb grade nodes. I hear...and have experienced, that Excellent grade nodes are not ALWAYS there. Basically you find it, and you are on a timer. I haven't been there to see the START of a timer...so I can not with any reliablity state how long that timer IS. But I can state that I got roughly 15 units (three at a time) before the node gave me the "at this time" message.

ALso...when you are on mainland and looking for nodes...if you see the "nothing at this time" message...MAP IT! That is either an excellent...or a superb, come back again every so often and take notes about what time of day...in game of course...whether it is raining or not...and if you can tell...what season. I have also heard that season change what nodes are where.

It seems things get interesting off the noob islands.